Evelynn Culver: He brought up something to the effect about resisting this, and how they resist the effects of the machine. Can people resist it, and what is their receptivity, and are they ready to use this, and so forth and so on. In other words, do you have to be at the end of your rope, so to speak, and have ended.

Jim: It will work for anyone. And even it will work for people who don't want to be helped.


Jim: Oh yes, oh yes, absolutely.

Guest: I can say that I use it with my clients too. But I use it with their full agreement that they are willing to work with this and I think it helps you can't..

Jim: You can't. I have even had people say this would be great in jails, where they are stuck there already. So there are a lot of applications But I think the school system is not going to be interested in this sort of thing. Well there are problems with the parents, the laws, and the legal, the, you know, political problems. I have talked to people where I tried to convince them the device works, and they don't believe because they didn't read about it. OK. Then I work with a few people and all of a sudden they start believing this might work. Then they switch and they say, oh my god, if this really works I'll be out of a job. And then they start fighting like crazy. I try to say, right now you are just expensive baby sitters. If you had a tool like this you could really help the kids. And you would have a job, that type of thing. Now there is that fear too. My god if this works. No. There is a tremendous resistance from the psychiatrist, the psychologist, social worker types, because it is not taught in their class. There is a problem with the school system, a legal problem. So it's never going to go there. Mary?

Mary Gorka: You know, the thing is, I've been in alternative practice in nursing, in Philadelphia and here, and what I think works is that you get it in from the outside. You get as many people as you can imagine using these things. You go to the hospital, you go to the schools and say "Why don't you have this? Why not, why aren't the . People in the schools having the benefit of something that has worked so well with my children, my neighbors, so forth, and just like what I call the ground wheat syndrome, when you could never get whole wheat bread in the supermarket until you kept asking and asking and asking for it. You just smile nicely and go ahead and do it where you can do it. Welcome as a healer, and this is a big thing, compared to being told in the hospital in Philadelphia, we don't do healing in hospitals.

Evelynn Culver: Talk about people who have trying to resist.

Jim: Thank you. This may be part of your question, I'm not sure, but Evelynn just reminded me of, well first, let me play this thing. OK? And then let me tell you about people who resist this. I'll tell you right now. The people that, most people find this very very relaxing.

Kay: I thought you were shy in front of a group?

Jim: Well, Kay says I . Ah, most people find the sound I am going to play very relaxing. Some people right away go into an altered state. People go into trips, see things, travel in the Universe,,, I can tell you lots of interesting stories. But, there are one or two people in a group that will absolutely hate, hate (END OF SIDE OF TAPE)

Kay Allison: Which number is this?

Jim: 54


Jim: What people hear is not necessarily what is coming out of the speakers. When I first demonstrate this to a group of people, about 30 people or so, meditating. And they said for the whole time. And then they said could you explain it again. And I did. And people came up to me and said "how did you make those sounds, and those bells, and the etheric sounds, and the choir and all that. And there are only two tones here. There is a 200 cycle tone and there is . Two tones are being played. And yet people hear this whole chorus of sounds, all these overtones and all these rising and singing, and wha wha wha, and none of that is coming out of the speakers..

Guest: No body else heard them?

Jim: Yea, sure. Crazy people hear those all the time.

Guest: In my eyes, all through me, the vibration. It just felt like it was crushing me, like I was underwater. It was uncomfortable. You know. It was just kind of.....

Jim: Usually that means that something needs to be worked on.

Guest: I felt like it just went straight through my head. Connecting.

Jim: It seems to become whatever needs to be picked on.

Guest: When I had it , cause I was just using the headphones, was like there was this after image for awhile after it goes off. Your ears are still kind of going , having these reverberations.....

Jim: And there are people see colors, and then people tell me all the images they see. Some people see crop circles, , star systems, some people fly over cities that they have never been to before, and people come back with answers to questions they've worked on for a month, and here's the answer. Everyone has a completely different experience here.

Guest: This is the relaxation tape?

Jim: This is the meditation/relax mode.

Kay: Well 54 might not have been your number.

Jim: But it does in fact, poke at things that need to be poked at. We get a lot of this, and some people panic and say oh my god, there is something wrong, well, like homeopathy, that you have the if something is wrong, it will start poking at you. So that means good news. If there is no affect whatsoever, then you are in great shape. Put me to sleep. This program here. I'd be asleep in 5 or 10 minutes. And what this told me, is that I had developed a sleep debt, I was working too hard, just shut down, and I would sleep for a couple of hours. But I needed it and this shut off the worry wort mind that kept me working. As I used this for awhile, I was able to judge how bad a shape I was in as to how long I slept. And after awhile I would come up and listen to it and I wouldn't fall asleep, so I must be OK then, I'll go back to work. So it is almost like an inverse measuring tool. If it doesn't affect you at all, that is the great news. If it does poke at you then there is something that needs to be looked at. Yes, Mary?

Mary Gorka: I have the writer's mind and I like to think in analogies, and to me this sort of reminds me of something combing very tangled hair. You know if your hair is short like mine, and not too tangled, you just go right on through it. But if you've got long hair and it's been running wild for awhile, it takes awhile to work through the tangles. And to me that sound sounds just like whooooowweeeeeee and sometimes it hurts to have the tangles done. So I think that is another thing to look at. I'm finished.

Eveynn Culver: I think I've built up kind of an immunity to it. It doesn't really affect me as dramatically as it did in the beginning. I am not going to tell you I am completely immune because if I put the headphones on and set my intentions to relax, and just surrender myself to it, it will take me pretty deep, pretty fast, and I still feel that sort of heaviness, as my body begins to relax, whether I want it to or not. I think one of the things that probably characterizes everyone's reaction, is that most of the function is kind of a hyper kinetic beta state most of the time. And I know Jim's had with people who were very intellectually oriented, scientific kind of minds that never slowed down, were intensely concentrating all the time, and almost panicked when this thing started to bring them out of that. They felt like they were loosing something. And, if you are in a state of mind to surrender to it, and just relax and will feel a bit heady. And as you move into a deeper state of consciousness, a delta/theta kind of thing happens and yeah, I think you are trying to resist that, and you really feel like you need to concentrate, it's not going to feel very comfortable. If you are, you know....but that's where it is pulling you. And like I said, after you liberate some of the stuff, as I did. When I first used it I think was kind of miserable for about two weeks because it seemed to liberate a lot of stuff that was just hanging around and needed to go. I emptied the trash, as a matter of speaking. And for about two weeks there was all this emotional stuff I was dealing with and I thought I'm going to have to get this back again, you know....I don't feel good. What's going on here. And after that I was fine. I'm still using it occasionally, not as often. But it definitely can help liberate things that are hanging around, patterned thought, emotions that are sort of lingering just below the surface. And I think initially it can make you a little uncomfortable to listen to it potentially. But if you can work your way past that I think you are going to be OK. But yea, there is sort of a, you know, something is taking you somewhere more or less against your will. It's a very powerful tool.

Jim: To tell a story about my friend Evelynn here. I tell it all the time when she is not around. I'll tell it when she is here. She complained the first week that she used the machine. She thought it was terrible. It was bringing up all this old garbage. And she was having all kinds of trouble with it. And I told her to try it one more week and I'd give her money back. And that was the problem. And the second week she discovered that the same garbage that came up the first week didn't come up again. Apparently what had happened is that Evelynn had had some things in her life that she slightly swept under the rug, but hadn't dealt with it. And this program here brings up these old things, and makes you look at them. I don't quite know how it does it but I have a lot of reports where it brings up traumatic events from this life, and I've even had people talk about past life trauma comes up and they see it for the first time. And I think what happened with Evelynn, she then looked at the thing, and said gone. So it is dealt with and is no longer an issue. And after the second week there is a whole closet full of stuff that she cleared out. And that is the good news. Did I tell that half way right?

Evelynn Culver: Yea, that's pretty good.

Jim: Thanks. I tell it better when you are not here. Well anyway, all kinds of things do come up. And, uh, getting to the relaxed state is really easy for some people. ......and they are gone. Other people fight it, because they have never been there. They don't know that as an experience. Foreign land. When people ask me if when I meditate do I think about these frequencies? And I say no, I remember what it felt like to be in that state. I remember what the skin felt like, I remember how heavy my arms were, and my legs I couldn't move them and I didn't know where my legs were. It's that feeling that I remember. But I never was able to get to those states without this device helping shut down the conscious mind. The frequencies...they are not doing anything particular. I think you are asking me about.....the frequencies are simply designed to occupy your mind. Occupy your mind, try to figure out what is going on. What you asked me consciously, what are you trying to do with that? I am trying to occupy your mind. So that it let's go of all things. Like if you have 3 or 4 balls in the air and somebody says "do you have a light"? Then all those balls are going to drop on the floor.

Guest: slowed down sustained I was relaxed, and it came in, and no no,,, I am already there. Leave me alone.

Jim: Well, if you were able to get there without this help, then that is good. Some people complained, matter of fact, Ed's wife complains that this gets her out of the meditative state. And this may be true, but the majority of people can't ever get any where near that. So this helps to get the mind out of it. And then once the program stops then you can go wherever you want to go. Supposed to clear the field of garbage, if you want to call it that. Sure.

Guest: If this clears the fields of garbage, or whatever it is you said, it just occupies the mind, how do you address the brain washing techniques that they used during the Korean War?

Jim: I know nothing about brain washing techniques. I don't know.

Evelynn Culver: Uuh, we don't want to get into that.

Jim: It's not my field. I don't know..

Guest: Right because if this clears the mind, it would only be if something else came in on top of that. When the mind was cleared. Probably, so. And everybody uses these on their own.

Jim Yea. I don't know mind washing techniques...

Evelynn Culver I am not an expert on brain washing, but I do know a little bit about it. And you use sensory deprivation, and you take people's protein away and their mind turns to noodles after a short period of time. And, you basically bring them into a physiological space where they are highly susceptible to suggestions. And they loose their sense of themselves and their personality starts to break down. And, that's not really what this is supposed to be doing. But, in my experience as someone who tries to spend a lot of time in altered states, and I sometimes do it for a living, doing readings and channnelings for people, uh, I want my consciousness mind, my personality structure to step aside so that I can listen and be in communion with other own higher consciousness, the collective consciousness. Perhaps the collective consciousness is for one else. The higher consciousness for one else. And learning to go into deep states of consciousness, it helps me do this. This is to me a training device. I can't use it while I am trying to channel for someone. It is an impediment. It helps me get into altered states of consciousness. If I want to relax, it is a training device. It gives me a workout, as a matter of speaking. And I asked him to write some programs that would allow me to hang out, rather than go through the sweeps. OK he did a lot of sweeping to get rid of this as a sort of brain exerciser. And I said "Jim, I want you to slow some of this sweeping thing down, and I want you to get me some steps. Slow, let's hang out one place and . So he drew up some other programs that are more toward the end of the relaxation programs where you can get to hang out a little bit. I have used the Monroe tapes and that is one of the things they do, they sort of take you down and you stay there for the whole time. And that is a different kind of experience. OK. That wasn't really how this was designed. Programs could be written on this machine to do that. But it was really designed more like something to wake your brain up. I mean, that's how I have always looked at this machine, as something that is going to put my brain through the paces and wake it up. Would I use it if I was trying to meditate and focus in a particular place or space that I need to go to? Not necessarily. I might use it initially to sort of get me relaxed but I personally, if I was going to channel from some of the sources that I usually do, I couldn't. Because I have to go there and sort of hang out. And I know exactly where to go. So that 's what this is to me. This is an exercise machine. And I think ....I mean, there is a lot of attention to reprogram it, because it does have a computer chip in it. So, I think it has a lot of untapped potential in that way.

Guest: So you are going to continue to write programs then?

Jim: We have already done some.

Evelynn Culver: I think the analogy to the brain washing thing is does sort of push, or help the personality structure, that is that little pattering voice and be distracted and relaxed and go into sort of a dormant state so that we can perhaps interface with some of the higher conscious functions and subconscious functions. I've found that it has definitely done a lot to my dreaming. And Mary, is a real dream person and I think that, you know, I don't know what it has done to your dreaming, but I think that I have experienced more lucid dreaming and more intense dreaming since I started using this. I have really tried to do this lucid dreaming thing. So, that is another interesting aspect of this. I don't think it was designed for, but it just seems to have that effect. Anyway.

Jim: This wasn't designed to do what you are talking about. Evelynn. This was designed strictly to get the mind out of the way. This was not designed to focus you into Focus l2, or whatever the Monroe people do. I had someone who used to work for Monroe try this machine and he told me that he really loved Monroe stuff. And he really did it for many years. But he found it kept him in a certain space. He could only go where this was designed to go and he couldn't travel anywhere else. He felt almost trained into that sync and he wanted to do other things and he couldn't. So he stopped using Monroe stuff. He did the TM and he spent years learning TM. He found it so difficult, the mantras and all that. But he finally learned how to do, but then when he got to where he could go wherever he wanted to so he felt it was beneficial. Not to be focused on one thing. When he experienced the program you just listened to now, he gave me a very high comment, he says, this could have saved him years of TM. But when this stopped playing, he could go wherever he wanted to. In other words, this took his conscious mind out of there, it got him down into a relaxed state, and then he could travel to whatever Universe he wanted to go to. So this could save years of TM, watching candles, all the various techniques that are out there that take such a long time. But this is not designed to focus you in any particular meditate state. As a matter of fact, let me speak on that for a moment. Ah, we found out kind of accidentally, or maybe not accidentally, but I have a friend who was quite psychic and he started making drawings of things I had not shared with anyone yet, some inventions I hadn't built yet. He would make me drawings of them . He would write what they were and so forth. I couldn't figure out how he would know that. Secret you know. Anyway, being very psychic, one day he started telling me about he is going to kill somebody. This girl that needed to be killed. She is a bad person. He is going to kill her. And I said this doesn't sound too balanced, type of thing. And then the story comes out, someone, man or someone, is telling he has to do this. And she will reward him by his winning the kick boxing championship of the whole world. Does this sound valid? This sounds real sick, I don't think so. But I couldn't talk him out of it. So some spirit apparently was tied into him, and controlling him. Which is kind of a shame. And I spent a couple of weeks talking to him, trying to talk him out of this stuff. And I couldn't. I couldn't reason with him. Finally I said, let's go to my house. And I put this program on. Within 5 minutes he says "I am free. Oh My God, I'm FREE. Do you know what I almost did? I almost killed somebody. My god, she has been lying to me and da da da da....." So apparaently he was under the power of a spirit. Not a good one apparently. And he didn't realize he couldn't get out of it, but this sound disconnected the linkage. OK. So this echo's what you were saying to me that when you tied into it, it interfered with your time. And I've had quite a few other experiences like that where it helped people who are maybe schizophrenic, if that's really an illness, hear voices and so forth. The program you just listened to shuts down that kind of chatter, or take over, or whatever, I don't know too much about that world OK. But I know that it seems to help people disconnect from bad spirits, if that is what it is. That is not my world, this is more Evelynn's type of world. But so therefore this would confirm that this disconnects your channeling. So basically for your kind of work, you would use this to get rid of your daily stress, get rid of all the things you have heard about all day long. Shut down, and once you get there, you turn the thing off, and go where you need to go. The other thing we've talked about, Evelynn and I are working on some programs designed to do specifically different directions, different frequencies, and so forth. We have begun that work. But don't have anything ready yet. I am going to play you a frequency range that Evelynn poked me into doing. Go ahead.


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